Green light for Helston's former Julian Graves shop change of use

Green light for Helston's former Julian Graves shop change of use

Green light for Helston's former Julian Graves shop change of use

First published in News

Consent has been granted to change the use of the former Julian Graves shop in Helston’s Meneage Street, despite objections from neighbouring residents, business owners and the town council.

The approved application was for the change of use of the ground floor of the premises from A1, retail, to A2 and A3 use - professional and financial services and restaurants or cafés. The former shop has lain empty for two years.

Vickery Holman Property Consultants had said: “This proposal is hoped to attract new interest in the potential use of the property and bring the listed building back into use so it can be continually looked after while also helping to prevent the gradual decline in the listed building features.”

The application, though, had attracted opposition from some residents concerned about smells and noise that may accompany a restaurant/cafe. Helston Town Council also recommended the application be refused.

Cornwall Council case officer, Catherine Bray, did not agree. “The principle of allowing A2 and A3 uses within this location is considered acceptable within the town centre location and would be compatible with its surroundings,” she said.

“Uses A2 and A3 would provide either the option for professional and financial services or restaurants or cafés, which will help to contribute to the strength of the town which has suffered the loss of businesses over the years.

“But in an attempt to bring another vacant building back into use it is important to offer different uses of the building which will still attract people into the town centre.

“If granted permission for A2 or A3, there is still an option to keep it for A1 use if required or it can be changed back without the need for separate planning permission.

“Concerns have been raised from the occupiers of neighbouring properties with regards to noise and smell concerns if the premises were to be used for a restaurant or café. As it stands it would be preferential to retain the retail use but it has been demonstrated that there is not enough interest in this size property to be used as a retail unit at present.

“The use of the building as a restaurant is a normal use you would expect to see within the town centre, and although the opening a hours would be longer a residence in this location would be expected to experience higher levels of noise in this location.

Environmental health would be involved if noise or smell issues were to become a severe problem.”

Comments (17)

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12:12pm Sat 10 May 14

Gill Z Martin says...

I thought the concept and availability of the Helston Business Park, was meant for those wishing to bring professional or business services to Helston.
Offices above shops are also ideal for such businesses.

Helston already has The Coffee Bean, Ruth's, The cup and cake, The Open Door Cafe, The Park Cafe, Costa Coffee, Pubs, The Guildhall a couple of days a week, the Methodist Chapel coffee mornings, etc. How many more cafes can Helston sustain before it seriously affects the business of those long time traders.

It appears another case of Cornwall Council ignoring the wishes of Helston Town Council. I thought the localism act was supposed to bring more power in decision making to local councils.
How much local knowledge does the Cornwall Council case officer actually have about Helston and its current needs?
I thought the concept and availability of the Helston Business Park, was meant for those wishing to bring professional or business services to Helston. Offices above shops are also ideal for such businesses. Helston already has The Coffee Bean, Ruth's, The cup and cake, The Open Door Cafe, The Park Cafe, Costa Coffee, Pubs, The Guildhall a couple of days a week, the Methodist Chapel coffee mornings, etc. How many more cafes can Helston sustain before it seriously affects the business of those long time traders. It appears another case of Cornwall Council ignoring the wishes of Helston Town Council. I thought the localism act was supposed to bring more power in decision making to local councils. How much local knowledge does the Cornwall Council case officer actually have about Helston and its current needs? Gill Z Martin
  • Score: 10

5:58pm Sat 10 May 14

Gill Z Martin says...

The former Julian Graves shop is up to let at a guide price of £17,500 per annum, I would imagine one would have to run a very lucrative business to make that sustainable. Instead of altering the classification, perhaps lowering the letting price would have been more constructive.
The former Julian Graves shop is up to let at a guide price of £17,500 per annum, I would imagine one would have to run a very lucrative business to make that sustainable. Instead of altering the classification, perhaps lowering the letting price would have been more constructive. Gill Z Martin
  • Score: 14

7:43pm Sat 10 May 14

helztonboy says...

as this planning application was to give some flexibility to its future use I don't see any need to panic or worry as many have done. Due to the nature of the site any new use would require additional planning permission for change of signs etc.

Personally I would like to see a quality restaurant or bistro enter the town, there are many good places to eat and drink during the day but the night time offer is limited.

But it would take a brave person to take on that site with that rent.

What ever business takes the site I hope they treat it in the same way as "Olivers" was and that the old name could be used.
as this planning application was to give some flexibility to its future use I don't see any need to panic or worry as many have done. Due to the nature of the site any new use would require additional planning permission for change of signs etc. Personally I would like to see a quality restaurant or bistro enter the town, there are many good places to eat and drink during the day but the night time offer is limited. But it would take a brave person to take on that site with that rent. What ever business takes the site I hope they treat it in the same way as "Olivers" was and that the old name could be used. helztonboy
  • Score: -3

8:57pm Sat 10 May 14

Gill Z Martin says...

helztonboy wrote:
as this planning application was to give some flexibility to its future use I don't see any need to panic or worry as many have done. Due to the nature of the site any new use would require additional planning permission for change of signs etc.

Personally I would like to see a quality restaurant or bistro enter the town, there are many good places to eat and drink during the day but the night time offer is limited.

But it would take a brave person to take on that site with that rent.

What ever business takes the site I hope they treat it in the same way as "Olivers" was and that the old name could be used.
I think that would be a lovely idea to use the name Eddys.
[quote][p][bold]helztonboy[/bold] wrote: as this planning application was to give some flexibility to its future use I don't see any need to panic or worry as many have done. Due to the nature of the site any new use would require additional planning permission for change of signs etc. Personally I would like to see a quality restaurant or bistro enter the town, there are many good places to eat and drink during the day but the night time offer is limited. But it would take a brave person to take on that site with that rent. What ever business takes the site I hope they treat it in the same way as "Olivers" was and that the old name could be used.[/p][/quote]I think that would be a lovely idea to use the name Eddys. Gill Z Martin
  • Score: 7

8:02am Mon 12 May 14

Lord Barrington Forbes-Smythe says...

People objecting to a café due to the potential smell and noise - and this is right in the high street! I'm sorry but that sums Helston right up, that does, in my opinion.
People objecting to a café due to the potential smell and noise - and this is right in the high street! I'm sorry but that sums Helston right up, that does, in my opinion. Lord Barrington Forbes-Smythe
  • Score: -4

3:08pm Mon 12 May 14

Gill Z Martin says...

Lord Barrington Forbes-Smythe wrote:
People objecting to a café due to the potential smell and noise - and this is right in the high street! I'm sorry but that sums Helston right up, that does, in my opinion.
I suppose this is one of the problems with having residential accommodation mixed with high street businesses, such as new builds up alleyways and flats above shops, because if for example one purchased a property above a business in a category that does not allow a cafe etc, they may not have purchased that property had they known the category would be altered to something which may impinge on their quality of residential living.
[quote][p][bold]Lord Barrington Forbes-Smythe[/bold] wrote: People objecting to a café due to the potential smell and noise - and this is right in the high street! I'm sorry but that sums Helston right up, that does, in my opinion.[/p][/quote]I suppose this is one of the problems with having residential accommodation mixed with high street businesses, such as new builds up alleyways and flats above shops, because if for example one purchased a property above a business in a category that does not allow a cafe etc, they may not have purchased that property had they known the category would be altered to something which may impinge on their quality of residential living. Gill Z Martin
  • Score: 7

8:01am Tue 13 May 14

ronedgcumbe says...

To me it was the objection to the stalls having generators on flora day. Honestly one day a year. It does seem odd to live in the main street and object to a possible cafe opening. I suppose you can find course for objecting to anything with a shop it could be the possible noise of tills ringing.
To me the change is sensible as retailers clearly have little intrest in the town centre.
Maybe Helston should promote where it excels for instance it is surly the number one town for a haircut or for those wishing to buy a second home in Porthleven.
To me it was the objection to the stalls having generators on flora day. Honestly one day a year. It does seem odd to live in the main street and object to a possible cafe opening. I suppose you can find course for objecting to anything with a shop it could be the possible noise of tills ringing. To me the change is sensible as retailers clearly have little intrest in the town centre. Maybe Helston should promote where it excels for instance it is surly the number one town for a haircut or for those wishing to buy a second home in Porthleven. ronedgcumbe
  • Score: -1

8:26am Tue 13 May 14

Lord Barrington Forbes-Smythe says...

Fair points, Gill and Ron, although I think anyone buying a high street property for residential purposes should be able to take whatever comes in their stride.
I remember when Julian Graves opened there maybe only 5 years ago. At the time, it was obviously not required as there was already a shop "Pick n Save", or something) selling dried fruits/herbs etc at low cost a few doors down. I wonder if the council should have held out for a more sensible tenant at the time, rather than an "expanding" national chain that obviously didn't really know the local market. If they'd allowed change of use then, maybe the objectors wouldn't have even bought their flats or whatever due to a cafe's presence. Or maybe they would and just enjoyed moaning about it!
Fair points, Gill and Ron, although I think anyone buying a high street property for residential purposes should be able to take whatever comes in their stride. I remember when Julian Graves opened there maybe only 5 years ago. At the time, it was obviously not required as there was already a shop "Pick n Save", or something) selling dried fruits/herbs etc at low cost a few doors down. I wonder if the council should have held out for a more sensible tenant at the time, rather than an "expanding" national chain that obviously didn't really know the local market. If they'd allowed change of use then, maybe the objectors wouldn't have even bought their flats or whatever due to a cafe's presence. Or maybe they would and just enjoyed moaning about it! Lord Barrington Forbes-Smythe
  • Score: 8

11:39am Tue 13 May 14

Gill Z Martin says...

ronedgcumbe wrote:
To me it was the objection to the stalls having generators on flora day. Honestly one day a year. It does seem odd to live in the main street and object to a possible cafe opening. I suppose you can find course for objecting to anything with a shop it could be the possible noise of tills ringing.
To me the change is sensible as retailers clearly have little intrest in the town centre.
Maybe Helston should promote where it excels for instance it is surly the number one town for a haircut or for those wishing to buy a second home in Porthleven.
I think the biggest problem Helston has in attracting new retailers is the price of the rents. It is not a huge town with a massive footfall, so whoever takes on some of those rents I think is quite brave.
It is a shame the rents cannot be capped.
[quote][p][bold]ronedgcumbe[/bold] wrote: To me it was the objection to the stalls having generators on flora day. Honestly one day a year. It does seem odd to live in the main street and object to a possible cafe opening. I suppose you can find course for objecting to anything with a shop it could be the possible noise of tills ringing. To me the change is sensible as retailers clearly have little intrest in the town centre. Maybe Helston should promote where it excels for instance it is surly the number one town for a haircut or for those wishing to buy a second home in Porthleven.[/p][/quote]I think the biggest problem Helston has in attracting new retailers is the price of the rents. It is not a huge town with a massive footfall, so whoever takes on some of those rents I think is quite brave. It is a shame the rents cannot be capped. Gill Z Martin
  • Score: 8

11:50am Tue 13 May 14

Gill Z Martin says...

Lord Barrington Forbes-Smythe wrote:
Fair points, Gill and Ron, although I think anyone buying a high street property for residential purposes should be able to take whatever comes in their stride.
I remember when Julian Graves opened there maybe only 5 years ago. At the time, it was obviously not required as there was already a shop "Pick n Save", or something) selling dried fruits/herbs etc at low cost a few doors down. I wonder if the council should have held out for a more sensible tenant at the time, rather than an "expanding" national chain that obviously didn't really know the local market. If they'd allowed change of use then, maybe the objectors wouldn't have even bought their flats or whatever due to a cafe's presence. Or maybe they would and just enjoyed moaning about it!
As the former Julian Graves shop is next door to the cup and cake cafe, I had wondered if they were planning on moving next door to extend?

I agree, I did not think Julian Graves would last long in Helston, given the existing competition and the out of town supermarkets. There is only so many nuts someone wants.
[quote][p][bold]Lord Barrington Forbes-Smythe[/bold] wrote: Fair points, Gill and Ron, although I think anyone buying a high street property for residential purposes should be able to take whatever comes in their stride. I remember when Julian Graves opened there maybe only 5 years ago. At the time, it was obviously not required as there was already a shop "Pick n Save", or something) selling dried fruits/herbs etc at low cost a few doors down. I wonder if the council should have held out for a more sensible tenant at the time, rather than an "expanding" national chain that obviously didn't really know the local market. If they'd allowed change of use then, maybe the objectors wouldn't have even bought their flats or whatever due to a cafe's presence. Or maybe they would and just enjoyed moaning about it![/p][/quote]As the former Julian Graves shop is next door to the cup and cake cafe, I had wondered if they were planning on moving next door to extend? I agree, I did not think Julian Graves would last long in Helston, given the existing competition and the out of town supermarkets. There is only so many nuts someone wants. Gill Z Martin
  • Score: 8

8:13pm Wed 14 May 14

helztonboy says...

Lord Barrington Forbes-Smythe wrote:
Fair points, Gill and Ron, although I think anyone buying a high street property for residential purposes should be able to take whatever comes in their stride.
I remember when Julian Graves opened there maybe only 5 years ago. At the time, it was obviously not required as there was already a shop "Pick n Save", or something) selling dried fruits/herbs etc at low cost a few doors down. I wonder if the council should have held out for a more sensible tenant at the time, rather than an "expanding" national chain that obviously didn't really know the local market. If they'd allowed change of use then, maybe the objectors wouldn't have even bought their flats or whatever due to a cafe's presence. Or maybe they would and just enjoyed moaning about it!
do you really think the council chooses who go into which shop!!
[quote][p][bold]Lord Barrington Forbes-Smythe[/bold] wrote: Fair points, Gill and Ron, although I think anyone buying a high street property for residential purposes should be able to take whatever comes in their stride. I remember when Julian Graves opened there maybe only 5 years ago. At the time, it was obviously not required as there was already a shop "Pick n Save", or something) selling dried fruits/herbs etc at low cost a few doors down. I wonder if the council should have held out for a more sensible tenant at the time, rather than an "expanding" national chain that obviously didn't really know the local market. If they'd allowed change of use then, maybe the objectors wouldn't have even bought their flats or whatever due to a cafe's presence. Or maybe they would and just enjoyed moaning about it![/p][/quote]do you really think the council chooses who go into which shop!! helztonboy
  • Score: 7

8:24am Thu 15 May 14

ronedgcumbe says...

helztonboy wrote:
Lord Barrington Forbes-Smythe wrote:
Fair points, Gill and Ron, although I think anyone buying a high street property for residential purposes should be able to take whatever comes in their stride.
I remember when Julian Graves opened there maybe only 5 years ago. At the time, it was obviously not required as there was already a shop "Pick n Save", or something) selling dried fruits/herbs etc at low cost a few doors down. I wonder if the council should have held out for a more sensible tenant at the time, rather than an "expanding" national chain that obviously didn't really know the local market. If they'd allowed change of use then, maybe the objectors wouldn't have even bought their flats or whatever due to a cafe's presence. Or maybe they would and just enjoyed moaning about it!
do you really think the council chooses who go into which shop!!
I wouldn't of thought so Helston council took years to decide whether or not to buy a van.
[quote][p][bold]helztonboy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Lord Barrington Forbes-Smythe[/bold] wrote: Fair points, Gill and Ron, although I think anyone buying a high street property for residential purposes should be able to take whatever comes in their stride. I remember when Julian Graves opened there maybe only 5 years ago. At the time, it was obviously not required as there was already a shop "Pick n Save", or something) selling dried fruits/herbs etc at low cost a few doors down. I wonder if the council should have held out for a more sensible tenant at the time, rather than an "expanding" national chain that obviously didn't really know the local market. If they'd allowed change of use then, maybe the objectors wouldn't have even bought their flats or whatever due to a cafe's presence. Or maybe they would and just enjoyed moaning about it![/p][/quote]do you really think the council chooses who go into which shop!![/p][/quote]I wouldn't of thought so Helston council took years to decide whether or not to buy a van. ronedgcumbe
  • Score: 6

8:31am Thu 15 May 14

Lord Barrington Forbes-Smythe says...

I know they don't do much but I guess they would have to approve it at least, or someone could have just turned poor old Eddy's into a lap-dancing club... Wait, I think I'm on to something there ;-)
I know they don't do much but I guess they would have to approve it at least, or someone could have just turned poor old Eddy's into a lap-dancing club... Wait, I think I'm on to something there ;-) Lord Barrington Forbes-Smythe
  • Score: -6

8:44am Thu 15 May 14

Gill Z Martin says...

ronedgcumbe wrote:
helztonboy wrote:
Lord Barrington Forbes-Smythe wrote:
Fair points, Gill and Ron, although I think anyone buying a high street property for residential purposes should be able to take whatever comes in their stride.
I remember when Julian Graves opened there maybe only 5 years ago. At the time, it was obviously not required as there was already a shop "Pick n Save", or something) selling dried fruits/herbs etc at low cost a few doors down. I wonder if the council should have held out for a more sensible tenant at the time, rather than an "expanding" national chain that obviously didn't really know the local market. If they'd allowed change of use then, maybe the objectors wouldn't have even bought their flats or whatever due to a cafe's presence. Or maybe they would and just enjoyed moaning about it!
do you really think the council chooses who go into which shop!!
I wouldn't of thought so Helston council took years to decide whether or not to buy a van.
Lol
[quote][p][bold]ronedgcumbe[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]helztonboy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Lord Barrington Forbes-Smythe[/bold] wrote: Fair points, Gill and Ron, although I think anyone buying a high street property for residential purposes should be able to take whatever comes in their stride. I remember when Julian Graves opened there maybe only 5 years ago. At the time, it was obviously not required as there was already a shop "Pick n Save", or something) selling dried fruits/herbs etc at low cost a few doors down. I wonder if the council should have held out for a more sensible tenant at the time, rather than an "expanding" national chain that obviously didn't really know the local market. If they'd allowed change of use then, maybe the objectors wouldn't have even bought their flats or whatever due to a cafe's presence. Or maybe they would and just enjoyed moaning about it![/p][/quote]do you really think the council chooses who go into which shop!![/p][/quote]I wouldn't of thought so Helston council took years to decide whether or not to buy a van.[/p][/quote]Lol Gill Z Martin
  • Score: 8

8:47am Thu 15 May 14

Gill Z Martin says...

Lord Barrington Forbes-Smythe wrote:
I know they don't do much but I guess they would have to approve it at least, or someone could have just turned poor old Eddy's into a lap-dancing club... Wait, I think I'm on to something there ;-)
I disagree that they do not do much, you cannot categorise all councillors, different councillors are responsible for different things on various committees.
[quote][p][bold]Lord Barrington Forbes-Smythe[/bold] wrote: I know they don't do much but I guess they would have to approve it at least, or someone could have just turned poor old Eddy's into a lap-dancing club... Wait, I think I'm on to something there ;-)[/p][/quote]I disagree that they do not do much, you cannot categorise all councillors, different councillors are responsible for different things on various committees. Gill Z Martin
  • Score: 2

8:48am Thu 15 May 14

ronedgcumbe says...

17 and a half grand a year just to make the rent. You'd have to do a lot of lap dancing but I wish you every success with this idea to bring this service to our town.
17 and a half grand a year just to make the rent. You'd have to do a lot of lap dancing but I wish you every success with this idea to bring this service to our town. ronedgcumbe
  • Score: -3

2:10pm Mon 2 Jun 14

telstar1962 says...

I thought the problem of enticing decent National Chain Stores to Helston was the lack of big enough premises.

I counted over 25 premises in Helston, including Pubs, where you can buy a cup of tea or coffee. Now that's just silly
I thought the problem of enticing decent National Chain Stores to Helston was the lack of big enough premises. I counted over 25 premises in Helston, including Pubs, where you can buy a cup of tea or coffee. Now that's just silly telstar1962
  • Score: 2

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